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18 inch wheel + Race Slick / Rolling Diameter


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#1 Pierre Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:29 AM

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Few queries:

My car is completely stock, aside from replacing rotors and pads.

Wondering whats the widest 18 inch wheel that will fit?

Considering overall diameter of the wheel/tire combo, I'm figuring I would be about 40mm max and as close as maybe 5mm off the stock overall rolling diameter. How will this effect the AWD and ABS?

Lastly, brake temperatures. Wondering if by running a smaller wheel, will the brakes get less cooling? And how much less. Wondering if ducting would have to be implemented.

Thank you.

Edited by Pierre, 11 January 2013 - 01:45 PM.




#2 elf_cruiser Posted 11 January 2013 - 07:08 PM

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I went with 19's for a track setup due to the cooling, and also the offset. The way the upright is shaped, you can run a higher et with a 19" wheel vs an 18" wheel. I picked up some 19x11et25 vmr v710's and they barely poke out from the front fender. I'm also on stock suspension. I think a set of jdm fenders and some lowering springs would tuck them back in nicely. I'll have to wait and see how they do on track since I just got them. There is barely enough room for the wheel to clear the upright, i think maybe an et27 or 28 would still fit but no more.

That said, I would look for an 18x10.5 with an offest around 30, maybe 32 at the most but it'll be very close to the upright.

Edited by elf_cruiser, 11 January 2013 - 07:10 PM.



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#3 AutoXGTR Posted 28 January 2013 - 05:57 PM

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View PostPierre, on 11 January 2013 - 11:29 AM, said:

Few queries:

My car is completely stock, aside from replacing rotors and pads.

Wondering whats the widest 18 inch wheel that will fit?

Considering overall diameter of the wheel/tire combo, I'm figuring I would be about 40mm max and as close as maybe 5mm off the stock overall rolling diameter. How will this effect the AWD and ABS?

Lastly, brake temperatures. Wondering if by running a smaller wheel, will the brakes get less cooling? And how much less. Wondering if ducting would have to be implemented.

Thank you.

For 18" wide wheels see post #16
http://www.gtrlife.c...heels-wont-fit/

AWD and ABS will be fine if you can keep front and rear tire diameters very close 1-3%. Another solution is to use the same tire size on front and rears with either the same size wheels or slightly wider wheels in the rear but choose wheels that can fit the same tire size.

In general if you can increase width of the front wheel and or tire compared to stock, you can reduce understeer, The biggest problem in the front is using a 18" wheel that can fit over the large front brake caliper or clear the inside suspension parts if offset is not aggressive enough.

If you choose a tire size that is smaller than stock you can lower the center of gravity even with stock suspension but be careful about going too low since there can be risk of scraping the front lower lip area on tracks that have dips or rises if taken at higher speeds. Tire diameter as low as about 25.5-26" can be used with stock suspension vs OEM 28".

Brake cooling with a 18" can be slightly reduced. If you upgrade brake pads and brake fluid that will help. Brake ducting is also helpful. It is also possible to use a wheel spacer in front depending on how wide the wheel is to increase a little space for cooling. A wheel stud that is longer than stock will help when using a spacer.


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#4 Pierre Posted 28 January 2013 - 08:30 PM

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Thank you for the replies.

I learned today that Yokohama makes a A-005 slick in 20 inch size. That would seem to be the best/easiest solution.

Now to find out who can get me a set.. and how much O_O$$$$ And what sizes they offer in 20 inches.



#5 AutoXGTR Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:11 AM

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View PostPierre, on 28 January 2013 - 08:30 PM, said:

Thank you for the replies.

I learned today that Yokohama makes a A-005 slick in 20 inch size. That would seem to be the best/easiest solution.

Now to find out who can get me a set.. and how much O_O$$$$ And what sizes they offer in 20 inches.

I don't see the 20" sizes for the A005 only up to 18"
http://www.yokohama-...yres/ADVAN-A005
http://distributors...._Motorsport.pdf

For the Elise a set of four tires is about $1800


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#6 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 12:30 PM

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I don't how how available they are. But I know I've seen HKS and GREDDY use 20 inch slicks on their demo/track cars.

http://www.speedhunt...t_hks_r35_gt_r/

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HKS, up until late last year, were using the stock radial tires on the R35, managing a best of 1'48"94 before switching to slicks. Their first attempt on the sticky race tires yielded a best of 1'47"126 with Orido behind the wheel. You can see the video of the lap here. Now with the new 20-inch Advan A-005, the time has dropped further.

http://www.gtrblog.c...an-gt-r-part-2/

Quote

Firstly lets check out the tyres on this beast, we can quickly see that these are no street tire and a full slick is fitted. It’s actually a prototype Yokohama Advan A005 265 wide (front) tyre in 20 inch size.




#7 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:06 PM

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The 20" Advans are not available for purchase in the USA - trust me we've tried! haha

Based on our experience, the GT-R is faster around a track with tires that are close to or taller than the stock overall diameter and no one offers an 18" slick that is even close to the 28" stock OD.  I would suggest a 19" setup with a square 295/35 19 Hoosier R6; this tire is closest to the stock diameter and will still fit under the stock front fenders (with the correct wheel offset).


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#8 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:17 PM

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There are Hoosier and Michelin full slicks that are almost exactly the stock overall diameter @ 18 inches. Even 19.

The problem is, the widths. They require a 12-13 inch wide wheel. I'm sure that won't fit with the stock struts. I don't even know by just adding coil overs and getting the exact offset wheel if it will still fit under the stock fenders and quarter panels?



#9 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:01 PM

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View PostPierre, on 29 January 2013 - 02:17 PM, said:

There are Hoosier and Michelin full slicks that are almost exactly the stock overall diameter @ 18 inches. Even 19.

The problem is, the widths. They require a 12-13 inch wide wheel. I'm sure that won't fit with the stock struts. I don't even know by just adding coil overs and getting the exact offset wheel if it will still fit under the stock fenders and quarter panels?

Yes, they do offer them but none that will fit under the factory fenders.  

The stock struts do not interfere with any of these widths - the upper A Arm in the front is what you have to worry about clearing and with a 19" wheel you will clear more than an 18" because of how that arm curves.  

Also, do you need a full slick like the Hoosier R100 or Michelin competition slick or would something like the Hoosier R6 suffice?  What are your goals here?  Do you plan on modifying the suspension of the car?


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#10 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:23 PM

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View PostMike@TopSpeed, on 29 January 2013 - 03:01 PM, said:

Yes, they do offer them but none that will fit under the factory fenders.  

The stock struts do not interfere with any of these widths - the upper A Arm in the front is what you have to worry about clearing and with a 19" wheel you will clear more than an 18" because of how that arm curves.  

Also, do you need a full slick like the Hoosier R100 or Michelin competition slick or would something like the Hoosier R6 suffice?  What are your goals here?  Do you plan on modifying the suspension of the car?

Nah, don't need a full slick. An R6 will do just fine with what I do with the car. Was just seeing my options and how possible it was to get a setup where I could either run a DOTR like the R6 and a Full Slick.

The overall goal is to get away from the Bridgestone RFT, spensive to replace and they go away quickly. At the same time, don't harm the AWD and ABS by changing the setup.



#11 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:36 PM

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Oh ok, I gotcha.  

Honestly, I would even suggest trying out the R888 on your factory wheels; unless of course you just want a second set of wheels to pop on to go to the track.  The thing is that a Hooiser R6 will make the car faster and is more appropriate for track use but they will offer more grip than the factory shocks can really handle.


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#12 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:02 PM

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View PostMike@TopSpeed, on 29 January 2013 - 03:36 PM, said:

Oh ok, I gotcha.  

Honestly, I would even suggest trying out the R888 on your factory wheels; unless of course you just want a second set of wheels to pop on to go to the track.  The thing is that a Hooiser R6 will make the car faster and is more appropriate for track use but they will offer more grip than the factory shocks can really handle.

Well I have new RFT now, and you cant really unmount and remount them. So it'd be a waste.

Either way, I'd probably rather have a track wheel or something dedicated for the track.

Eh, I don't like the R888 option, for a little more money a wheel, I could run the R6. And yea I'm familiar with the R6, I've used it on a few other cars.

I wonder if the tie rod issue, that nut coming lose will be more of an issue?



#13 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:13 PM

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Ahh, I gotcha.  Well in that case, a good set of HREs or Forgelines in 19" with the Hoosier R6 would be a great track setup.  In fact, we've done a few sets of those in the past for customers and they work very well.  

Not sure what you mean by "tie rod issue", but you won't have any issues with the suspension coming loose on you by running the R6 if that's what you're referring to.


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#14 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:18 PM

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For some reason, the nut on the tire rod comes lose over time. Nissan didn't use the proper nut or something, and the only way it stays on is cause it has a cotter pin. My service guy says its normal from track use. It's been awhile since I got the explanation, but it's something like that.



#15 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:41 PM

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View PostPierre, on 29 January 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

For some reason, the nut on the tire rod comes lose over time. Nissan didn't use the proper nut or something, and the only way it stays on is cause it has a cotter pin. My service guy says its normal from track use. It's been awhile since I got the explanation, but it's something like that.

This is only an issue for the early production year GT-Rs and there is a Nissan Technical Service Bulletin on this so you should be able to have the dealer replace the nut to the correct one if your car was affected by it and hasn't been done yet.  What year is your car?


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#16 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:45 PM

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View PostMike@TopSpeed, on 29 January 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

This is only an issue for the early production year GT-Rs and there is a Nissan Technical Service Bulletin on this so you should be able to have the dealer replace the nut to the correct one if your car was affected by it and hasn't been done yet.  What year is your car?

2010.

What offsets would I be looking at for a 19'' wheel to get a 295 tire under the fenders/quarters? Fronts and rears.



#17 elf_cruiser Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:53 PM

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Pierre - see this link for what I did with a 19x11" ET25 wheel:
http://www.vividraci...ocity-motoring/

The fronts stick out quite a bit, but that's not an issue due to the smaller diameter of these tires. I've done 2 track events so far with this setup and I'm very happy so far. If you want to keep the tires under the fender you will be limited to a 10" wheel, MAYBE a 10.5 ??
For a 10" wheel I would shoot for about +37ET, for a 10.5" then about +31ET. Those will give you the best chance of clearing the fenders. Alternately, you can get wider front fenders, camber adjustments, and lowering springs - those will all help keep the tire under the fender...


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#18 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:55 PM

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View PostPierre, on 29 January 2013 - 04:45 PM, said:

2010.

What offsets would I be looking at for a 19'' wheel to get a 295 tire under the fenders/quarters? Fronts and rears.

Ok, you likely won't have an issue with that bolt then but to be safe I would check with your dealer.  Just ask them if there are any open TSBs on your car.  

For the wheels, I would run something like:

19x10 +35 - Front
19x11 +18 - Rear

Are you looking at any wheel in particular?


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#19 Pierre Posted 29 January 2013 - 07:25 PM

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View Postelf_cruiser, on 29 January 2013 - 04:53 PM, said:

Pierre - see this link for what I did with a 19x11" ET25 wheel:
http://www.vividraci...ocity-motoring/

The fronts stick out quite a bit, but that's not an issue due to the smaller diameter of these tires. I've done 2 track events so far with this setup and I'm very happy so far. If you want to keep the tires under the fender you will be limited to a 10" wheel, MAYBE a 10.5 ??
For a 10" wheel I would shoot for about +37ET, for a 10.5" then about +31ET. Those will give you the best chance of clearing the fenders. Alternately, you can get wider front fenders, camber adjustments, and lowering springs - those will all help keep the tire under the fender...


I don't like how those stick out at all. I'm not going to do wide body or new suspension or anything. If I do, I'll just go with the Michelin slicks then.

View PostMike@TopSpeed, on 29 January 2013 - 04:55 PM, said:

Ok, you likely won't have an issue with that bolt then but to be safe I would check with your dealer.  Just ask them if there are any open TSBs on your car.  

For the wheels, I would run something like:

19x10 +35 - Front
19x11 +18 - Rear

Are you looking at any wheel in particular?

mmmmm, no, no particular wheel design atm. I've dealt with HRE and Forgeline a lot. I know with those guys I'll be able to get any size I want. Just as long as the tire and wheel tuck under the fenders/quarters, or at least don't stick out.

The slicks wouldn't work anyway, I forgot how much camber I had to run to make them work on a 987 and a M3. Yea, the R6s should be plenty.



#20 Mike@TopSpeed Posted 30 January 2013 - 08:06 AM

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Ya, R6s will get you were you want to be.  

We are a big dealer for HRE and Forgeline - let me know if you'd like some fitment ideas and an estimate.


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