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NISSAN: DO YOU WANT TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM?


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#21

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Posted 11 October 2008 - 02:25 PM

Here is the answer we want from Nissan:

GT-R owner: "Nissan I just toasted my transmission during numerous LC's. Can you fix it for me? IT IS under warranty. Yes, I drive it agressively and abusively. That is what the car is meant for."

Nissan: "SURE! no problem. We will replace the transmission under warranty!"


Is that realistic to ask of Nissan or any other car manufacturer?


I haven't toasted my transmission - yet. I haven't used LC since reading septskyline's Oct 4 post.

And yes, it is realistic to ask Nissan to warranty use of a stock feature of the car. But tell me exactly how to use it. Don't deny its existence.

#22

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Posted 11 October 2008 - 02:48 PM

This is my first post, however I have been lurking since nagotrac started, and read as much as possible about the GTR. I was planning on purchasing one next year, hopefully used to save myself a bit of money. I'm hoping nissan releases an updated trans with stronger gears, and gives an extended warranty on the trans and free replacement on failgure to any cars within the first year of manufacturing, with the weak gears.

Has anyone ever considered that perhaps the transmission is NOT breaking because of using LC, but perhaps the gears (1st and 2nd so far correct?) which are stripping had defects in the manufacturing process?

Ask yourself this: Why in the world would using LC even 1000 times have anything to do with 2nd gear stripping itself?

For all you naysayers, who think people shouldn't expect a super-car status sports car's transmission to withstand a few hundred launches...and cite examples such as honda or corvette. In my research, when corvette or mustang rear ends (not transmissions) fail is when launching on prepared tracks, with slicks, and power adders. You expect to break things at that point.

Transmissions aren't what usually gives when launching... they die either from failed synchros because of high rpm downshifting and synchros not being up to the task of functioning as intended from the factory, or because of tremendous amounts of added power which tears up the gears.

Stock sports cars should be able to withstand launching and "abuse" as some like to call it, as it is part of driving a sports car.

As some have also mentioned, usually the clutch packs and driveshafts are designed to break/slip before the gears in a transmission fail, as the gears should be designed to take much more power than the stock engine can dish out.

Also, if caused by using LC, shouldn't the transmission failure happen when launching, and not a week after?

Just some food for thought, to add to the fire.

Edited by Sage, 11 October 2008 - 03:33 PM.


#23

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Posted 11 October 2008 - 03:27 PM

I'm glad you wrote this:

but i have to say something...

even with a re-inforced tranny, and an addition of guidlines for use of the LC - people are STILL going to abuse LC... and if you're asking the 'black box' to be removed..keep dreaming, as this monitoring system is quickly becoming the norm in all new and upcoming cars.
ALL semi's and 18 wheelers have them, but it's a round piece of paper that's placed behind the speedometer, and when they get pulled over, they take it out, and it records 24 hrs of driver speed. so it's being merged with the car industry now.

sp back to the 'stronger' miracle tranny. I'm sure as soon as the V-spec comes out (if that's still happening with the recent suspension of all production/orders), things will change.


I'm only asking Nissan to allow us to run the performance times it advertised. Nissan DID allow/encourage 3rd party publications to promote their product, WITHOUT A DISCLAIMER on the use of LC in any review.

The truth is that without LC, this car is slow from a standing stop - the delay for the first 0.5-0.8 seconds is absurd.

Give us a reinforced transmission which will take the stresses of the multiple launches, within reasonable parameters, and then warranty that. I suggested 150-200/year, no 2 launches in succession and setting parameters for x launches per week and per month. If any of you have other suggestions for reasonable LC parameters, then please post it on this thread.

If there is abuse beyond the reasonable and recommended LC parameters (which can be proven by Nissan), then the owner should pay.

Nissan needs to define "abuse" and what parameters they would use to prove it. Abuse should not include transmission failure due to their design flaws.

Nissan must address the wheel hop issue.

Nissan should stop violating privacy laws by using the black box to deny claims.

And allow us to retain a good resale value on the car by solving these problems.

Edited by robharr61, 11 October 2008 - 04:39 PM.


#24 elpasogtr

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Posted 11 October 2008 - 08:46 PM

I JUST WENT OFF ROADING IN MY HUMMER. I TURNED THE STABLITRACK BUTTON TO ON, TURNED THE REAR AXEL LOCK ON, AND HIT THE 4LOW LOCK BUTTON. I JUST HIT THREE BUTTONS TO GIVE ME MAX TRACTION AND OFF ROAD ABILITY. IS HUMMER GOING TO VOID MY WARRANTY NOW. I was thinking about this post as i did that. I was leaning more towards the nissan understanding. but now I think it is stupid for them to have a function in our vehicle that can "void" or trani's warranty. Granted this may be a different situation. but i also could have taken the normal road to my mothers house but decided to go accross the desert over mesquite bushes, and sand dunes instead. Nissan is wrong to deny any warranty claims like hummer would be wrong to deny a warranty claim bc i took my vehilce off road. The hummer was made for off road driving, not on a daily basis but granted it was engineered to go off road. The gtr was engineered to be a super car and provide us with supercar performance. We should be able to get the most out of our cars. If a function allows better performance then we should be able to use it. Just like the hummer would'nt perform the same without 4low, sabilitrack, and rear axel lock.
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#25

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Posted 11 October 2008 - 10:09 PM

I JUST WENT OFF ROADING IN MY HUMMER. I TURNED THE STABLITRACK BUTTON TO ON, TURNED THE REAR AXEL LOCK ON, AND HIT THE 4LOW LOCK BUTTON. I JUST HIT THREE BUTTONS TO GIVE ME MAX TRACTION AND OFF ROAD ABILITY. IS HUMMER GOING TO VOID MY WARRANTY NOW. I was thinking about this post as i did that. I was leaning more towards the nissan understanding. but now I think it is stupid for them to have a function in our vehicle that can "void" or trani's warranty. Granted this may be a different situation. but i also could have taken the normal road to my mothers house but decided to go accross the desert over mesquite bushes, and sand dunes instead. Nissan is wrong to deny any warranty claims like hummer would be wrong to deny a warranty claim bc i took my vehilce off road. The hummer was made for off road driving, not on a daily basis but granted it was engineered to go off road. The gtr was engineered to be a super car and provide us with supercar performance. We should be able to get the most out of our cars. If a function allows better performance then we should be able to use it. Just like the hummer would'nt perform the same without 4low, sabilitrack, and rear axel lock.


But the h2 wasn't even built for off road- its a soccer mom suv. And yes, if god forbid I bought an h2 and I took it off road and something broke (not due to me hitting a rock or anything of course, lets say the transmission overheats and takes a crap while crawling up a hill, because what, it's only designed to pretend to be an off-roader?!) then you bet I'm going to go to the dealer and get it fixed under warranty.

My point is, if you hit something or otherwise physically damage your car, then it should be 100% your responsability to fix. But if a product is designed to be used in a certain manner, it should be engineered to perform as such, and most modern products are designed with a certain built in safety margin so that they are stronger than needed.

#26

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Posted 11 October 2008 - 11:56 PM

I'm only asking Nissan to allow us to run the performance times it advertised. Nissan DID allow/encourage 3rd party publications to promote their product, WITHOUT A DISCLAIMER on the use of LC in any review.

The truth is that without LC, this car is slow from a standing stop - the delay for the first 0.5-0.8 seconds is absurd.

Give us a reinforced transmission which will take the stresses of the multiple launches, within reasonable parameters, and then warranty that. I suggested 150-200/year, no 2 launches in succession and setting parameters for x launches per week and per month. If any of you have other suggestions for reasonable LC parameters, then please post it on this thread.

If there is abuse beyond the reasonable and recommended LC parameters (which can be proven by Nissan), then the owner should pay.

Nissan needs to define "abuse" and what parameters they would use to prove it. Abuse should not include transmission failure due to their design flaws.

Nissan must address the wheel hop issue.

Nissan should stop violating privacy laws by using the black box to deny claims.

And allow us to retain a good resale value on the car by solving these problems.


with all the posts you wrote, you might as well go and drive your GT-R and enjoy it before the transmission get busted.
you will get more out of it.

if you don't like the black box, you shouldn't have bought the GT-R like that florida lawyer.

btw, get real with the 150-200 launches per year. lol.

#27 speedracer

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 12:23 AM

So if you do a track day or auto cross in the car , you should drive with the traction control on ? Doesn't this give slower laptimes especially when the car cuts the engine reves when it feels slipping?

#28 Goodwood

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 04:12 AM

So if you do a track day or auto cross in the car , you should drive with the traction control on ? Doesn't this give slower laptimes especially when the car cuts the engine reves when it feels slipping?

VDC in R mode allows for some slippage, ie, power induced oversteer. Any more slippage, and I would think you'd be offroading.

#29 NissanGTR

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 09:19 AM

Yes, the car with vdc off is supposed to be pretty nasty when she lets go. The R mode is supposed to be excellent on the track, and I wouldn't doubt that it was left ON (R mode) for the 7:29 time on the Nurburgring.

Edited by NissanGTR, 12 October 2008 - 09:20 AM.

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#30 elpasogtr

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 09:35 AM

But the h2 wasn't even built for off road- its a soccer mom suv. And yes, if god forbid I bought an h2 and I took it off road and something broke (not due to me hitting a rock or anything of course, lets say the transmission overheats and takes a crap while crawling up a hill, because what, it's only designed to pretend to be an off-roader?!) then you bet I'm going to go to the dealer and get it fixed under warranty.

My point is, if you hit something or otherwise physically damage your car, then it should be 100% your responsability to fix.



i was trying to make a valid point about the similarities in the vehicles functions (3 buttons) to produce a desired or maximum function. (LC or 4x4 ability) I wasnt looking for someone to shit on my hummer and let me know its for soccer moms. It has a lot of ability to off road. Im not talking about smacking it against a rock under 4x4 not am i talking about using LC to smash the GTR into a wall. You last statement at least sides with me ("But if a product is designed to be used in a certain manner, it should be engineered to perform as such, and most modern products are designed with a certain built in safety margin so that they are stronger than needed.")
My point is lets try to side with one another instead of against each other. Especially when it comes down to issues such as warranty ect.
GTR #1. Bucket of bolts, traded for 2012 black edition.

GTR #2 ---2009 RED - Titeck spoiler and other carbon fiber parts.
This car is a tank. Has never had a problem in 4 years.

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#31

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 12:47 PM

i was trying to make a valid point about the similarities in the vehicles functions (3 buttons) to produce a desired or maximum function. (LC or 4x4 ability) I wasnt looking for someone to shit on my hummer and let me know its for soccer moms. It has a lot of ability to off road. Im not talking about smacking it against a rock under 4x4 not am i talking about using LC to smash the GTR into a wall. You last statement at least sides with me ("But if a product is designed to be used in a certain manner, it should be engineered to perform as such, and most modern products are designed with a certain built in safety margin so that they are stronger than needed.")
My point is lets try to side with one another instead of against each other. Especially when it comes down to issues such as warranty ect.


Sorry, I read your post to mean- I take my hummer off-road, do I expect hummer to warranty, no. Therefore, I LC my GTR, do I expect warranty, No. Guess I misread it.

You meant that if I press some buttons on my hummer, I still expect them to warranty it. Same with the GTR.

We all need to stick together to get this issue taken care of. We should put together a thread (Admins should sticky it at the top of this forum) GTR LC and transmission issues. Keep it clean, and log any and all info we can find on GTR transmission failures.

#32 elpasogtr

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 01:15 PM

i agree!!!
GTR #1. Bucket of bolts, traded for 2012 black edition.

GTR #2 ---2009 RED - Titeck spoiler and other carbon fiber parts.
This car is a tank. Has never had a problem in 4 years.

GTR #3---2012 Blue black edition. Holy shit I love this car.

#33 MindlessOath

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Posted 12 October 2008 - 09:37 PM

4.1 secounds to 60 is not slow. anything after that is slower than a z06 and some other cars. its the gearing. if you read the motor trend article you would have also known a few more facts, like from a roll the r35 will loose most of the time.

please, oohhh please tell me you dont just buy something off the flip of a whim, and for only something like launching a car. wow. so naive.

#34 GTRzilla

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Posted 13 October 2008 - 05:09 PM

Another tranny down (GTRfallapart) (that we know of). Instead of having someone from corporate downloading info from the Data Recorder and dening claims, they should be tearing apart these trannies to figure out why they are failing. Nissan needs to come out with a statement soon before the reputation of their flagship suffers any further harm. I feel it is bad buisness to download some info from the Data Recorder and flat out deny warranty coverage unless the trannies are full inspected for flaws. If these cars were truely abused, Nissan has every to deny their claim, however Nissan's definition of abuse is turning off the VCD except when being stuck in the snow. Use LC once and tranny fails.....shell out $20,000. Use LC 20 times and it fails 2 weeks later....tough luck....shell out $20,000. I had enough faith in this car that I bought it without even a test drive. Nissan has enough faith in the tranny that if you turn the VCD off and something breaks, they will deny your claim.
Not fair that one of the greatest cars ever produced is getting a bad reputation. If Nissan told the customers with failed trannies that they would investigate the failure, and pending their investigation they would either deny or grant their claim, this mess would have never reach to the circus it has now become. Nissan is handling this very poorly in my opinion. The only way to salvage their reputation is to ensure existing and potential customers that they are working on the problem (if indeed there is one) and will do what it takes to fix it. Most of us will eventually want to mod are cars at one point or another (lets face it its our nature......just look at this website and the interest in titanium exhausts, reflashed ECUs, coil overs, etc.), but after the issues some are having with LC and turning off the VCD, how could you, in your right mind, even consider it!
Yes it is poor judgement to use LC after the owner's manual tells you not to (indirectly since LC is not even mentioned in the owners manual and only mentions turning the VCD off ). Even poorer judgement to be using LC before you have properly broken in your car, but I was hoping the tranny was a bit more builtproof and could handle a little more "abuse" than giving out at 900 miles. I have launched modified STis (400+ hp) with rpms close to redline before dumping the clutch and felt the violence of all 4 wheels screaming and biting for traction as I was being painfully rocked and jarred foward, and yet the tranny still managed to hang together (yes this was abused and the car was modified and therefore would not expect to Subaru to filp the bill if something broke). But really......900 miles and the tranny goes? I hope GTRfallapart's car was not complete stock and aleast had some modifications. Again, we don't know all the facts, but if septskyline and GTRfallapart are telling the truth, these reports are concerning.

Nissan please get this situation under control before it goes any further.

Edited by GTRzilla, 13 October 2008 - 07:01 PM.

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#35

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Posted 13 October 2008 - 05:17 PM

Another tranny down (GTRfallapart) (that we know of). Instead of having someone from corporate downloading info from the Data Recorder and dening claims, they should be tearing apart these trannies to figure out why they are failing. Nissan needs to come out with a statement soon before the reputation of their flagship suffers any further harm. I feel it is bad buisness to download some info from the Data Recorder and flat out deny warranty coverage unless the trannies are full inspected for flaws. If these cars were truely abused, Nissan has every to deny their claim, however Nissan's definition of abuse is turning off the VCD except when being stuck in the snow. Use LC once and tranny fails.....shell out $20,000. Use LC 20 times and it fails 2 weeks later....tough luck....shell out $20,000. I had enough faith in this car that I bought it without even a test drive. Nissan has enough faith in the tranny that if you turn the VCD off and something breaks, they will deny your claim.
Not fair that one of the greatest cars ever produced is getting a bad reputation. If Nissan told the customers with failed trannies that they would investigate the failure, and pending their investigation they would either deny or grant their claim, this mess would have never reach to the circus it has now become. Nissan is handling this very poorly in my opinion. The only way to salvage their reputation is to ensure existing and potential customers that they are working on the problem (if indeed there is one) and will do what it takes to fix it. Most of us will eventually want to mod are cars at one point or another (lets face it its our nature......just look at this website and the interest in titanium exhausts, reflashed ECUs, coil overs, etc.), but after the issues some are having with LC and turning off the VCD, how could you, in your right mind, even consider it!
900 miles and the tranny goes? Yes it is poor judgement to use LC after the owner's manual tells you not to. Even poorer judgement to be using LC before you have properly broken in your car, but I was hoping the tranny was alittle more builtproof than giving out at 900 miles.

Nissan please get this situation under control before it goes any futher.


i suggest these newbies coming on board and claim to have their tranny busted to upload proofs of such problem.
in the mean time, please do not take them seriously.

the bad reputation you mentioned are just perpetuated by these posts.

#36 GTRzilla

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Posted 13 October 2008 - 05:47 PM

i suggest these newbies coming on board and claim to have their tranny busted to upload proofs of such problem.
in the mean time, please do not take them seriously.

the bad reputation you mentioned are just perpetuated by these posts.


Agree, I was modifing my post as you posted your reply. Many people hate/are jealous of this car. There needs to be verification of people's claims that their trannies are failing.

Edited by GTRzilla, 13 October 2008 - 05:48 PM.

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#37 MindlessOath

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Posted 13 October 2008 - 06:05 PM

the price keeps going up on these trannies :P i belive they only cost 13k but SOME dealers are charging around 18k for parts, and labor. im not sure what other components they are replacing, mabe seals and gaskets, or whatever, i dunno.

apparantly its really easy to uninstall and install a trans from the R35... it really shouldnt be so much. i think i seen it on curtesy parts they were only 13k if im not mistaken.

#38 mcduck

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Posted 13 October 2008 - 06:53 PM

So if you do a track day or auto cross in the car , you should drive with the traction control on ? Doesn't this give slower laptimes especially when the car cuts the engine reves when it feels slipping?

no... the car is incredibly quick with everything in R mode and you get decent rotation when you apply power coming out of turns. I doubt turning the VDC off will improve your time. Maybe a wash, but better... doubtful.
The GT-R’s only two modes are viciously fast and off. “Off” as in engine dead, doors locked, driver elsewhere. - Bloomberg Review, Feb 8, 2012
This thing is a four-wheeled Ducati with a decent windscreen. - Dan Neil, WSJ - May 20, 2013
"... as you select the more aggressive dynamic modes you enter a world where you need to be absolutely on your mettle, not least because you're covering ground with the pace of a low-level fighter jet." - EVO, June 2014

#39 Trailblazer

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Posted 15 October 2008 - 05:28 PM

with all the posts you wrote, you might as well go and drive your GT-R and enjoy it before the transmission get busted.
you will get more out of it.

if you don't like the black box, you shouldn't have bought the GT-R like that florida lawyer.

btw, get real with the 150-200 launches per year. lol.

I don't agree with you. 150 launches a year is less than one every two days. If the car is warmed up properly, what's the problem with a single launch, or say 3 launches at a drag strip with proper time in between runs?

If Nissan had really intended us to use launch control, they would have tested it with a transmission that proved reliable with the feature. Then they would have addressed LC in the manual, with proper instructions on its use.

Edited by Trailblazer, 15 October 2008 - 05:30 PM.


#40 avanti5010

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Posted 15 October 2008 - 09:33 PM

All you IDIOTS who are crying about Nissan not honoring the warranty just don't get it.
Please sell your GT-R to someone who didn't buy it for drag racing.
GROW UP AND GET YOURSELF A DRAGSTER AND GET THE HELL OFF THIS SITE.
YOU ARE RUINING THE REPUTATION OF THE GT-R AND NISSAN.
PLEASE JUST GET LOST!



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