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Droptopp's TSM 4.1 ELITE Prime MONSTER

54K views 270 replies 64 participants last post by  MichaelBertini 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Droptop's hotrod is finally back home and ready to be enjoyed! For those of you following this saga it has been an interesting road for him to say the least. I am not really interested in speaking about his past failures and experiences but rather about the bright future for this great client and amazing car!

The car came to us plagued with issues, using oil and not running correctly. Fingers could be pointed upways, downways or crossways if we all wanted to but in the end no one wins. Situations like this while unfortunate are sometimes the reality when lots of people are involved in one build. I try to advise people constantly as to how much power there is in picking one shop, a shop that has proven, consistent results and stick with them! Do not go behind their backs, do not question what they say, pay them their due profits because I promise you in the end you will not only have a much more enjoyable car but also you will absolutely save money.

This build is a bit of a unique one. A lot of the parts on the car were usable but Droptop wanted to change things up a bit. While he was enjoying the car before it was lacking in a few areas when it came to drivability, spool and response. Even being a stroker he just wanted more "fun factor" if you wanna call it that. We talked back and forth quite a bit about it and came up with a plan without completely remodeling the entire car.

The goal was as instant boost response as made sense to keep the tire on the ground while maintaining 1400+ hp very usable. The older 35r kit he had simply was not doing that.

First off as most reading this probably know we needed to redo the engine. We opted for our 4.1 stroker engine. I can not say enough about our stroker engines and the R&D they have gone through over the years. Lots of you may not know or remember but we were using 4.4 and 4.1 strokers back on our old school Alpha16 shop car when no one could get them to work right. It didn't come without it's challenges but hey, nothing worth a shit in life does. Over the years they have been updated to be what I consider one of the best street engines you can purchase from anyone for the GT-R.

Our completely custom CP pistons use a different ring package than is even available for a GT-R piston. Our rod and main bearings are machined then coated to our specs that we have found provide the longest life as well as the highest resistance to power induced failure. The rods are Carrillo HD with just a few little tricks designed by the guys at our partner machine shop. All in all it's a very robust little package I'm confident will serve Droptop for quite some time.

He also opted to add our proprietary wet sump oiling system. This system is imperative to a high HP wet sump engine as it's chambered design always keeps the oil pump pickup submerged in oil. Most of the industry would be shocked to know how often air pockets get run through your engines oiling system causing all kinds of failure opportunities. The package starts with oiling passage modifications and works it's way to the oil pump with updates there. If you feel I am being very vague about this particular part it's because I most certainly am. Hundreds and hundreds of hours and more money than I care to add up has gone into our wetsump oiling systems. I don't sell them without our complete long block and I don't talk details about it publicly. So if you wanna know more, just buy one of our engines :) LOL

With that all sorted it was on to the turbo kit. With the goals stated above there are a few options. I'll talk through them a little so maybe it will help someone else interested in one of the setups.

You have the newest G series turbos that are dubbed the "quick spool" turbos and they do that pretty well. If we were going to do that I like the ETS kit as I feel it's the best quality for your dollar out there. Personally I however think the G series turbos leave a little to be desired. While the spool seems to be ok I still don't think it's crazy impressive for the power they seem to lack. But, one of those kits with a smaller turbine housing would be a fun street car for sure… there is no denying that.

Then you could argue something like the Omega12 or the BL stock frame kit. Both capable kits as well. The Omega12 just isn't capable of the power that the client was wanting however. Remember we are trying to make over 1400hp here and that kit just won't cut it. It also barely spools faster than a BL or one of our Prime kits. Great for a 1200hp street car but not what we were looking for.

The BL kit was an option and I have no problem with that kit, except that I think ours is better LOL! Maybe I am bias. I personally like the Xona billet turbo charger better than the Garrett in the factory frame application. I have tried them all and feel the Xona combination that Tial has made for us is second to none. The drive pressure numbers on our newest ELITE Prime numbers are simply impressive. That is something we have worked hard on as it is one of the biggest hangups of the factory frame turbo charger.

Ok so enough babbling about turbos. The ELITE Prime was the decisions. But not JUST the ELITE Prime, the all new PrimeR. The PrimeR is our new max effort turbo system. It is a 63.9mm inducer custom wheel made for us by Xona. It is not class legal for the 58mm classes at the two big events bur for those clients that just want the absolute best combination of spool and top end power they are simply incredible. More information about those in another thread soon.

For the fuel system we decided to stick with the 6 injector system vs. upgrade the manifold, and lines at this time. Later down the road Droptop will likely add the 12 injector manifold as well as a Motec to really top the car off. We however wanted him enjoying the car for a while before then. That said during the tuning that was most certainly the limitation of power. I wanna make sure everyone doesn't think that our new PrimeR make less than an all in Prime. We simply couldn't push it anymore as it was on the edge of the fuel system.

All said and done the package turned out absolutely amazing! We added some ETS 3.5" downpipes and y-pipe to get the max exhaust flow with his current cat back and assembled it with love :)

You can look at the dyno graph below but the way this thing comes up on the street is nothing short of a tire shredding animal. Once it's even thinking about making power you are in the seat and the car is GONE! Just look at the torque ramp from 3500-4000 how steep it is. With the added load of the street it's ungodly fast. Who needs rolling antilog!

I'm sure Droptop will be in here and his other threads to answer any questions. He loves 60-130s and posting data for you guys. We are very very proud that he chose TSM to aid in putting the nightmares in the past to move forward only with wet dreams. Thank you so much David for entrusting myself and my team to instill new life in the joy that your car brings you! We will be here to support 24/7 as long as you need us. Enjoy in good health sir!

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#2 ·

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#3 ·
That power curve is amazing and I'm so glad to finally see droptopp back in the seat and with a extremely well built car this time! It'll be a tough choice for me to for pro58's on my current ETS kit or come to the TSM camp. Did you stay with the stock CR for the stroker or bump it up a bit as well?

Also the graph says 3.8l
 
#4 ·
That power curve is amazing and I'm so glad to finally see droptopp back in the seat and with a extremely well built car this time! It'll be a tough choice for me to for pro58's on my current ETS kit or come to the TSM camp. Did you stay with the stock CR for the stroker or bump it up a bit as well?

Also the graph says 3.8l
Whoops thanks! Fixed
 
#6 ·
Congrats & Wild build droptop

& Hats off to TSM for changing the game again with the Elite Turbos!

but damn am i the only one being thrown off by that coolant tank??
LOL I'm not a pushy sales guy... I wanted to upsell him a TSM one so many times but couldn't bring myself to texting him
 
#8 ·
I have not been shy to say my favorite setup was the Alpha 9. Pretty close to stock like spool and enough hp on E85 to give almost anything on the street a run for its money. I had an absolute ton of fun in that setup.

As such, I have been following the Elite program since launch and constantly see these setups cleaning up at events and more importantly on the street.

After a few setbacks with previous builds and some real candid discussion with Cicio, I decided to go back to a stock frame setup on their 4.1 billet crank stroker with a new non-class PrimeR. (Love the name by the way, feel free to send new emblems).

I am so glad I decided to make the jump and more importantly trust TSM as I was ready to throw in the towel and jump to another platform. Cicio is a completely standup guy. Told him to change anything and everything he thought was needed and he didn't once add parts just to add parts.

The PrimeR is the real deal. Absolutely my new favorite setup. Spool is almost nonexistent and these turbos are almost as loud as my hellcat. I kept the muffled titanium rear with some fabrication help so it doesn't piss off the neighbors.

These turbos scream, even on wastage.

Around town it is smooth and Taylor's TCM tune is smooth in part throttle response, starts from red lights and parking lot driving.

I still cannot honestly believe these things are stock frame. Whatever secret sauce TSM has in these things they deliver more power and torque than my GTX3582R Gen II Kit and at a more useable street rpm.

Matter of fact the old setup feels like a two stroke KTM compared to these things. Absolutely no need for antilag with this setup.

Anyone looking to upgrade in this hp range would be nuts to go with any other setup. Absolutely nuts.

One of my biggest concerns over the years was having a local tuner to support the car and when Taylor remotely jumped on laptop real-time while I was driving to review data, sure made it a non-issue pretty quick.

All and all it has been a real pleasant experience working with Cicio, Taylor, Ricky and the whole crew at TSM.

I hope time will be kind to me and I look back on this thread years from now with the same smile on my face writing this.

Highlight real forthcoming [emoji91][emoji1360]
 
#9 ·
I have not been shy to say my favorite setup was the Alpha 9. Pretty close to stock like spool and enough hp on E85 to give almost anything on the street a run for its money. I had an absolute ton of fun in that setup.

As such, I have been following the Elite program since launch and constantly see these setups cleaning up at events and more importantly on the street.

After a few setbacks with previous builds and some real candid discussion with Cicio, I decided to go back to a stock frame setup on their 4.1 billet crank stroker with a new non-class PrimeR. (Love the name by the way, feel free to send new emblems).

I am so glad I decided to make the jump and more importantly trust TSM as I was ready to throw in the towel and jump to another platform. Cicio is a completely standup guy. Told him to change anything and everything he thought was needed and he didn't once add parts just to add parts.

The PrimeR is the real deal. Absolutely my new favorite setup. Spool is almost nonexistent and these turbos are almost as loud as my hellcat. I kept the muffled titanium rear with some fabrication help so it doesn't piss off the neighbors.

These turbos scream, even on wastage.

Around town it is smooth and Taylor's TCM tune is smooth in part throttle response, starts from red lights and parking lot driving.

I still cannot honestly believe these things are stock frame. Whatever secret sauce TSM has in these things they deliver more power and torque than my GTX3582R Gen II Kit and at a more useable street rpm.

Matter of fact the old setup feels like a two stroke KTM compared to these things. Absolutely no need for antilag with this setup.

Anyone looking to upgrade in this hp range would be nuts to go with any other setup. Absolutely nuts.

One of my biggest concerns over the years was having a local tuner to support the car and when Taylor remotely jumped on laptop real-time while I was driving to review data, sure made it a non-issue pretty quick.

All and all it has been a real pleasant experience working with Cicio, Taylor, Ricky and the whole crew at TSM.

I hope time will be kind to me and I look back on this thread years from now with the same smile on my face writing this.

Highlight real forthcoming [emoji91][emoji1360]
Huge congrats Droptopp... nicely done.

I'm contemplating the Alpha9...
 
#11 · (Edited by Moderator)
@gdzilla - if thinking A9 just go elite gateway if stock motor or elites/prime if building.

Quicker spool and more power all around.

No comparison and I think they are actually cheaper too.

@Daddy21 ballin ;)
 
#12 ·
While gathering the parts for my own car, i've been reading almost all build topics in here. I've read about Droptopp's many setbacks and frustrations along the way, and i'm glad to see he finally got his fantastic build.

According to what I see and read,I think both Doug from WGP as Cicio from TSM are a few of the best builders/tuners out there in U.S. They seem very knowledgeable and professional, and all of their customers are very enthousiastic.

I wish you the best of luck with your stunning car Droptopp! Healthy jealous :dance:

Hope to see some vids of this beast soon.

Do you have a complete list of mods on this buildup? Always interesting imo.
 
#13 ·
Do you have a complete list of mods on this buildup? Always interesting imo.
I'm fairly sure I've missed a bunch of things, but the big items are listed this time around :

TSM 4.1L Street R35 GT-R Short Block
-TSM Spec Oiling Modifications
-TSM Spec Stroker Crankshaft
-TSM Spec CP Billet Pistons
-TSM Spec Carrillo Rods
-ARP Main Studs
-Sonny Bryant Billet Crank
-Fresh Heads w/ ferrea valves and valve train, deck plate valve job, seals, etc.

GT1R VR38 V2 Billet Pro Harmonic Damper
TSM GT-R Oil Catch Can (Large Volume Version)
TSM Flex Fuel Kit
ID2000 Injectors
2017 Bellhousing
Tilton fly wheel
AMS billet deep oil pan

Since it was out of the car figured it was time to replace the timing chain and complete components.

TSM ELITE PrimeR Turbo - 64mm Billet Compressor Wheels
-Tial Wastegate Actuators
-3.5" Turbo Inlets w/ Couplers & Clamps

ETS 3.5" Downpipes - V Band outlet
ETS 3.5" - 4" V Band Pro Series Midpipe
STM 4" Titanium cat back

Sheptrans OneK deep pan, drop gears and all the goodies
AMS brushless fuel setup, rails, lines, etc.
STM race intercooler - bell cores
STM intakes
STM overflow tank
Stillen AP J Hook rotors and Project Mu race pads
DSS Axles

RAYS VOLK Racing TE37 Saga (Forged Monoblock)
18Ă—10.0 +35mm 5Ă—114.3 / 18Ă—12.0 +26mm 5Ă—114.3
Mickey Thompson ET Street S/S 275/45 and 345/35

TSM topped it all off with some fresh powder coating.

Cobb tune with traction control, antilag, autoshift, TCM tune, etc.
 
#14 ·
I'm fairly sure I've missed a bunch of things, but the big items are listed this time around...etc.
You didn't start out as stock, but would you be comfortable in suggesting a cost, if someone with a stock (say 2015) GT-R wanted to duplicate what you have?

50,000...75,000...100,000...greater?

Alexd
 
#16 · (Edited by Moderator)
All in over four different builds I have no idea, most likely higher than the numbers you have listed.

This time around under the numbers you have listed.

Starting from A9 and it wouldnât have been that bad Alex. Especially if motor just needs a refresh and build. I needed a new block.

Obviously Shep OneK + will be your largest chunk of change if you are not on one now.

Hands down so glad I went this route. These turbos are absolutely magnificent.
 
#17 ·
E78 - Map 3 35psi : autoshift @ 8100 rpm, full tank of gas, groceries in the trunk, 255lb driver.

No antilag - 2nd gear roll on at 40.

Absolutely smooth and flawless.

May have been spinning a bit around shifts at 63 degrees.

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#18 ·
Droptopp,

I'm really glad you finally got your car back and it's everything you had hoped for. I am getting my car upgraded by Doug at WGP with a 1K shep trans and the Elite Prime turbos. I won't run nearly as much power, but it should still be a beast.

What amounts of boost are you running by gear? I have an Ecutek, so I assume it can be set up with the traction control, antilag, autoshift as well?
 
#19 · (Edited by Moderator)
Thanks for the kind words. Trust me I am so glad I went back to a stock frame and thankful TSM developed the Prime to work with the 4.1. It seriously is a cream puff around town and has more power than you need.

These guys have this thing dialed in and Iâm assuming any Elite/Prime build will be the same from them.

TSM will have to comment about boost by gear on the various maps. I just know on the 35lb map I can punch it in first on 18s on the street and its straight as an arrow. I just steer and look out for woodchucks as it shifts at 8100.

Absolutely smooth an completely uneventful. Scared the shit out of my neighbor on wastegate. Hahaha

For the sound lol - he was struggling with the Gs

 
#20 ·
Another question to Droptopp:

Without mentioning any specifics HERE, do you anticipate passing emissions using the "previous knowledge" that most of us have? (I'm sure that you've given some thought to this...)

Alexd
 
#21 ·
Yep, passed emissions with flying colors feel free to PM me.
 
#23 ·
You didn't start out as stock, but would you be comfortable in suggesting a cost, if someone with a stock (say 2015) GT-R wanted to duplicate what you have?

50,000...75,000...100,000...greater?

Alexd
+1, Interested in this as well
With the billet crank this build runs around 80ish give or take from absolutely bone stock.

Droptopp,

I'm really glad you finally got your car back and it's everything you had hoped for. I am getting my car upgraded by Doug at WGP with a 1K shep trans and the Elite Prime turbos. I won't run nearly as much power, but it should still be a beast.

What amounts of boost are you running by gear? I have an Ecutek, so I assume it can be set up with the traction control, antilag, autoshift as well?
We rolll the boost in where the tire can hold it. The traction control on the factory ECU (any software it doesn't matter) is for sure not all it's cracked up to be. It "works" but not well. Rolling anti lag and auto shift are both a standard part of our build packages as well.

I would say we are 25ish PSI in second then most all of it in 3rd.. gate in 1st.
 
#25 ·
The last few years have been tough and those of us that followed along felt very bad for you. I completely understood when you said you had enough and would never deal with Company X again. You get to a point where it doesn't matter what they say or do, when you are done you are done. I am the exact same way.

Personally, Dave I am very happy for you. Enjoy it in good health my man.
 
#26 ·
Thanks Brother - not looking back and just happy as hell she’s home and full of some reliable hp.

Damn GoPro won’t connect on me iPhone for some reason otherwise I’d have a bunch of videos already haha.
 
#27 ·
Thanks Brother - not looking back and just happy as hell she's home and full of some reliable hp. Damn GoPro won't connect on me iPhone for some reason otherwise I'd have a bunch of videos already haha.
No need for the gopro anymore, just mount the cell phone and use the dragy app to record the video lol.
 
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