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Hey guys,

I am currently majoring in Kinesiology at Penn State(i'm ready for Paterno jokes
), and I love helping people with anything that encompasses bodybuilding, athletic performace, general health or just the old timer trying to get back into the gym.

I am currently training seven undergrads at my school, two soccer players at Lafayette University, a guard at Maine University, and a professional indoor soccer player(Omaha Vipers). I have done many scientific write-ups on dietary supplementation and nutrition. I also did an eight page paper on training tips for weight trainees. I'd be happy to email it to anyone that is interested.

I am also a paid representative/consultant on Bodybuilding.com(this is not my job, I am a full time college student).

Here is a link to my profile: http://bodyspace.bod...m/Shermanatorx/ I am currently cutting weight preparing for my first NPC competition(natural).

Ask any questions you'd like; this is good training and practice for me.

-Connor
 

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Chicken wings, beer, water; sleep, rinse, repeat.
 

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What are your thoughts on chocolate milk vs whey protein shakes for post workouts?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
What are your thoughts on chocolate milk vs whey protein shakes for post workouts?
First off, nutrient timing is irrelevant, i.e, a whey protein shake right after a workout, or a casein shake right before bed etc. A few years ago, it was believed that a whey(fastest digesting/utilization) protein shake was best taken immediately after a workout; this was known as the "anabolic window". More recent research(bigger and better funded) tells us other wise. Whey consumed at any time during the day is just as effective as a post workout whey shake.

The most important thing to consider is macro nutrients(carbs, protein and fat). Generally speaking, if one wants to build muscle, it would be wise for them to consume 1g of protein per lb of body weight. I currently weigh ~230lbs, so I try to consume at least 230g of protein. How, when or where you get that protein will not make a difference. Protein is made up of amino acids, amino acids are the building blocks of life(muscle is need to support life). It is very important so consume enough protein in order to maintain or gain muscle. Also, remember, muscle burns fat. It eats away at calories to maintain itself. If ones body is lacking protein especially, it will eat at itself, this is called muscle catabolism(the opposite of anabolism), if not taken care of, it will eventually cause muscle atrophy(opposite of hypertrophy).

I generally recommend people try to obtain their protein requirements through whole food, as it provides other macro nutrients as well as micro nutrients(vitamins, minerals, organic acids etc.).

This is not always possible with Americas fast paced life style. My recommendation is to pick up a whey protein powder that is GMP(Good Manufacturing Process)certified. Nothing in the dietary supplementation industry is FDA approved, not even the multi vitamin you're taking-they can only approve the label. Therefore, it's best to look for something GMP certified. I have seen various COA's for companies and I can guide you in the right direction if you'd like.

I realize that may have been a longer answer than you expected.

Are you currently taking any whey protein? If so, what brand?
 

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I'm PMing you shermanator, just looking for some insight.
Sounds good.

I received a PM from a member that will remain anonymous, and I think it would be good to outline his concern in this thread(as well as through pm).

He was talking about losing weight, and what was the best way to go about doing so.

My response:

A few things to consider.

The equation to lose or gain weight is really much simpler than people make it:

Losing weight: calories in < calories out

Gaining weight: calories in > calories out

What makes up the majority of those calories doesn't matter. It can be simple carbs, complex, protein, fiber, saturate fat, polyunsaturated fat etc.

My recommendation is to count calories. You wan't to consume 100-300 calories under your or BMR(Basal Metabolic Rate) if you're trying to lose weight. BMR is how many calories an individual burns at rest. Remember, your BMR decreases as you age too.

Plugging in your stats into a BMR(Basal Metabolic Rate) calculator, it comes up with 2416.95 calories.

Here is the calculator I used: http://www.bmi-calculator.net/bmr-calculator/

So, you would wan't to consume ~2200 calories a day. This will enable you to lose weight, I can guarantee it. This is all scientific, there is no guess work involved. If you follow this approach you will shed the pounds. This may be hard at first, so I would start a little higher(~3,000cals), and start to taper down.

If you were my client, I would put you on a weight training routine paired with some sort of cardio/plyometrics. The reason being, with P90x(and Insanity) you are not effectively building muscle, but rather just burning calories. If you read my post in the thread, muscle is very important for building a well balanced physique and increasing your BMR, enabling you to burn more calories just laying in be for instance.
 

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Does gaining muscle weight come quick like after a few weeks if you do the proper protein?
A few weeks may not be a sufficient amount of time.

Also, protein is only one aspect of gaining muscle(or weight in general). You also have to be eating enough calories, and follow a routine designed around your goals(endurance, myofibrillar/sarcoplasmic hypertrophy etc.)

These are two segments taken directly out of my paper:

Progressive Overload:

This is one of the most important rules in my opinion. This rule refers to continually increasing the demands of the musculoskeletal system in order to continually make gains in muscle size, strength and endurance. In simplest terms- In order to get bigger and stronger you must continually lift more and more and make your muscles work harder than they are used to. If you don't, your muscle will not become any bigger or stronger than they currently are. The human body is very smart and will adapt to the challenges you put forth on it. If you don't give your body a reason to grow, it won't. There are seven good ways to use the principle of Progressive Overload.

Numbers 1-6 are ways to increase training volume or make the muscle(s) do more work
Number 7 is a way to make your muscle(s) do more work in less time.
1- Increase Resistance ( this is number 1 for a reason)
Simply put- If you benched 300lbs for 3 sets of 5 reps, the following week you would increase that weight. The increase is usually very small (2.5, or 5lbs). If you try to increase the weight in larger increments, you will only be let down, or injured. Be patient, weight training is a marathon, not a sprint.

2- Increase Sets
Increase the number of sets you perform for a given exercise. Instead of 3 sets of bench, try 4 to really fatigue the muscle.

3- Increase Repetitions
Increase the number of repetitions you do for a given exercise. Don't stop yourself at some magical number- push yourself to do 1 or 2 more reps, you can use a spotter if necessary.

4- Increase Frequency (not recommend for beginners)
Increase how often you train a certain muscle or muscle group. This technique is most useful for improving lagging or weak muscles.

5- Increase Exercises
Increase the number of exercises you perform for a certain muscle or muscle group with the addition of a new one to your current program. An example for chest day would be doing dumbbell pullovers, something you didn't have in your routine before. You can also do something like combining chest and back day.

6- Increase Intensity
This principle refers to how much effort you put into every set and rep. This is hard for many people to do, only because a big chunk of it has to do with mind set. A good training partner will serve to push you harder and keep you on task if you are not easily internally motivated.

7- Decrease Rest Time
Decreasing the rest time between consecutive sets will force your body to adapt metabolically by removing toxins (lactic acid) and other byproducts of anaerobic exercise (weight lifting) faster and more efficiently over time. Eventually you will be able to lift more in less time.

Don't stress progressive overload too much at this point. You should only be concerned with rule #1.

The importance of proper nutrition:

Nutrition is without a doubt the most important topic in this write up. Inadequate nutrition when weight training is like winning a Ferrari, except it doesn't have any fuel. Think of the Ferrari as your training program, and the fuel as food. You can have the best training program in the world, but without proper nutrition you will only be left disappointed. Your body needs calories to build muscle. This doesn't mean eating junk food to obtain those calories. A serious weight lifters diet should consist of milk, chicken, fish, lean beef or pork, eggs, pasta, nuts, yogurt, fruit, lots of water and vegetables.

Rest is imperative as well, with out it, your muscle will not heal, and therefore will not get stronger/bigger. I generally tell my trainees not to train the same muscle group more than 2x a week. The only exception would be people that have chosen to take AAS(anabolic androgenic steroids).

Again, feel free to ask for the paper and its entirety via email.
 

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Here is a simple routine, typically referred to as a "cookie cutter" routine. I made this for some guys at Penn State:

This routine is great if you do not know your max lifts(1rm for squat, deadlift, bench, and shoulder press). A good personal trainer or strength and conditioning coach will always base a clients routine off their max lifts, but that is not always the case.

This is a simple 3 day split. Each body part is worked once per week(Monday/Wednesday/Friday). For each exercise you're doing 3 sets for 5-8 reps.

Routine:

Back/bi's(all exercsies are 3x5-8)

Deadlifts
BB row
Lat pulldown
BB curl

Chest/tri's(all 3x5-8)

Bb bench
Incline bench
Chest dips
Skullcrusher

Legs/shoulders(all 3x5-8)

Squat
Hamstring curls
Shoulder press(DB or BB)
Calf work

Now, we have to incorporate some sort of progression to keep stressing the musculoskeletal system. You're going to pick a weight you're comfortable with for each exercise; this is going to be an adjustment period.

All weight remains the same:

-The first week, you're doing 5 reps for each exercise.

-The second week, you're doing 6 reps for each exercise.

-The third week, you're doing 7 reps for each exercise.

-The fourth week, you're doing 8 reps for each exercise.

After four weeks, you have reached 8 reps, now you have to increase the weight of each exercise and start back at 5 reps.

This is called dual factor training and it's an ingenious concept. It's called dual factor due to it's two methods of progression-weight and reps, as opposed to only one or the other.

-Connor
 

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First off, nutrient timing is irrelevant, i.e, a whey protein shake right after a workout, or a casein shake right before bed etc. A few years ago, it was believed that a whey(fastest digesting/utilization) protein shake was best taken immediately after a workout; this was known as the "anabolic window". More recent research(bigger and better funded) tells us other wise. Whey consumed at any time during the day is just as effective as a post workout whey shake.

The most important thing to consider is macro nutrients(carbs, protein and fat). Generally speaking, if one wants to build muscle, it would be wise for them to consume 1g of protein per lb of body weight. I currently weigh ~230lbs, so I try to consume at least 230g of protein. How, when or where you get that protein will not make a difference. Protein is made up of amino acids, amino acids are the building blocks of life(muscle is need to support life). It is very important so consume enough protein in order to maintain or gain muscle. Also, remember, muscle burns fat. It eats away at calories to maintain itself. If ones body is lacking protein especially, it will eat at itself, this is called muscle catabolism(the opposite of anabolism), if not taken care of, it will eventually cause muscle atrophy(opposite of hypertrophy).

I generally recommend people try to obtain their protein requirements through whole food, as it provides other macro nutrients as well as micro nutrients(vitamins, minerals, organic acids etc.).

This is not always possible with Americas fast paced life style. My recommendation is to pick up a whey protein powder that is GMP(Good Manufacturing Process)certified. Nothing in the dietary supplementation industry is FDA approved, not even the multi vitamin you're taking-they can only approve the label. Therefore, it's best to look for something GMP certified. I have seen various COA's for companies and I can guide you in the right direction if you'd like.

I realize that may have been a longer answer than you expected.

Are you currently taking any whey protein? If so, what brand?
I assumed most people used an after work out drink to replenish glycogen levels, with a "high" sugar content because it will deliver faster. As opposed to something with a "high" protein content which is absorbed slowly. I just use a generic 4:1 carbs:protein mix of apple juice and Whole Foods 365 vanilla whey. Seems to work ok, as I am not wiped during the hours following my work out. However I have not done much research in what people use to gain mass specifically though.

I am personally doing cardio/plyo/endurance training via BeachBody Insanity, and plan to move onto P90X2 next year along with incorporating running (I would love to add an ultra marathon to my list of things I accomplished).

As far as diet, I try to eat well, but that sometimes falls apart on weekends. My calorie goal is 2600-3000 a day, as I burn almost 1000 calories an hour with my current routine and am trying to loose some weight in addition to getting leaner. My nutrition ratio is set to get 40% Carb, 40% Protein and 20% Fat. Realistically, my carb percent is higher due to a vegetarian diet giving less options for almost pure protein. I know there are ways to fix that and I have tried, but it does not work with my lifestyle. I also know that my percent balance is not a "must", so I don't worry too much about it.

Here are two sites I enjoy reading, in case you have never seen them I figured I would pass them along. An entertaining look at fitness and nutrition.
http://steve-edwards.blogspot.com/
http://thefitnessnerd.blogspot.com/

Do you have a take on hemp protein in place of or in addition to whey? I was trying to measure the pros and cons.
 

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Thanks for all your help shermanator, I'm glad you took some time to personally help me out. This guy knows what he's talking about, I suggest you guys listen
 

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Thanks for all the stuff you posted OP. It seems like if you really don't pay attention to every little detail you can fudge something up or lead yourself down a road of disappointment. Do you have a cookie cutter plan for fat loss while adding muscle?
 

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Thanks for all the stuff you posted OP. It seems like if you really don't pay attention to every little detail you can fudge something up or lead yourself down a road of disappointment. Do you have a cookie cutter plan for fat loss while adding muscle?
I wouldn't stress every little detail.

Trying to lose fat and build muscle is called recomping, and it has more to do with diet than a routine. For the average joe who is natural, it's a waste of time. You will be left spinning your wheels, getting nowhere fast. If some one has ridiculous genetics, or is on AAS, then it's possible. But even then, bulking and cutting are still more effective.

Bulking and cutting are (when done correctly) a very effective way to put on muscle quickly, and get rid of excess body fat. However, bulking and cutting can be difficult, discouraging people to give it a try.

Bulk- When someone goes on a "bulk" that's simply increasing calories (caloric surplus). For a bulk, you take the normal amount of calories you would consume (maintenance), and add 200-500 calories more a day.

Cut- Cutting is decreasing calories (caloric deficit). When cutting you subtract 200-500 calories from your maintenance.

A good rule of thumb is gaining a pound a week when bulking, and losing a pound a week when cutting. If you're not achieving that, adjust your calories accordingly.

I would use that BMR calculator I posted in an earlier post. Once you get your number, I can help you further.
 

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Thank you as well for all the info. I don't run marathons yet, but I would like to in the next year.

As for the BeachBody products, I like them because I would never make it to a gym. Just not motivated enough or want to spend the additional time. They allow me to do it at home, and provide instruction for both the fitness and nutrition aspects without having to research everything. I still read up as much as I can though. It was an easy way to get a structured program, and the company didn't appear to fluff anything up. They promote good nutrition and exercise as the key to getting fit.

It would appear to me that Insanity targets mostly type II stimulation (on legs and core?), but you are only using your body as resistance. You know more than I do though, could you elaborate on what you would change?

For me, it is more exciting doing max cardio and plyo moves than lifting stuff. I just wasn't as motivated when doing weights, but maybe I never found something that was fun to do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thank you as well for all the info. I don't run marathons yet, but I would like to in the next year.

As for the BeachBody products, I like them because I would never make it to a gym. Just not motivated enough or want to spend the additional time. They allow me to do it at home, and provide instruction for both the fitness and nutrition aspects without having to research everything. I still read up as much as I can though. It was an easy way to get a structured program, and the company didn't appear to fluff anything up. They promote good nutrition and exercise as the key to getting fit.

It would appear to me that Insanity targets mostly type II stimulation (on legs and core?), but you are only using your body as resistance. You know more than I do though, could you elaborate on what you would change?

For me, it is more exciting doing max cardio and plyo moves than lifting stuff. I just wasn't as motivated when doing weights, but maybe I never found something that was fun to do.
I hear what you're saying, and in no way am I saying it's wrong or right. I am only giving my thoughts.

I'm not sure what exactly you're asking, if you can rephrase the question I can help you.

You seem like the type of person that would like Crossfit, Google that.
 

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I wouldn't stress every little detail.

Trying to lose fat and build muscle is called recomping, and it has more to do with diet than a routine. For the average joe who is natural, it's a waste of time. You will be left spinning your wheels, getting nowhere fast. If some one has ridiculous genetics, or is on AAS, then it's possible. But even then, bulking and cutting are still more effective.

Bulking and cutting are (when done correctly) a very effective way to put on muscle quickly, and get rid of excess body fat. However, bulking and cutting can be difficult, discouraging people to give it a try.

Bulk- When someone goes on a "bulk" that's simply increasing calories (caloric surplus). For a bulk, you take the normal amount of calories you would consume (maintenance), and add 200-500 calories more a day.

Cut- Cutting is decreasing calories (caloric deficit). When cutting you subtract 200-500 calories from your maintenance.

A good rule of thumb is gaining a pound a week when bulking, and losing a pound a week when cutting. If you're not achieving that, adjust your calories accordingly.

I would use that BMR calculator I posted in an earlier post. Once you get your number, I can help you further.
mine came out to 2450. and since i work out (can commit to i should say) 3-5 days of exercise, to multiply that by 1.55. that brings me to about 3800 calories to maintain my current weight it said. that seems like a lot of calories because 3500 is a pound of fat right? i should be able to cut that down to 2500 calories if i can supplement with a protein shake maybe twice a day or add vegetable drink made in the juicer. either way i don't pay attention to what i'm eating. it seems if i made portions the day b4 and limited snacks that would cut a lot of calories out.
 

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mine came out to 2450. and since i work out (can commit to i should say) 3-5 days of exercise, to multiply that by 1.55. that brings me to about 3800 calories to maintain my current weight it said. that seems like a lot of calories because 3500 is a pound of fat right? i should be able to cut that down to 2500 calories if i can supplement with a protein shake maybe twice a day or add vegetable drink made in the juicer. either way i don't pay attention to what i'm eating. it seems if i made portions the day b4 and limited snacks that would cut a lot of calories out.
Generally speaking, 3,500 cals equals a pound of fat.

Many people do cook/prepare their meals a day in advance. As for the protein shakes, just use them to try to meet your protein requirements.

You can also make a meal out of a protein shake.

Ex:

Whey protein
Frozen fruit
banana
milk
oats
peanut butter
Olive oil(if you need the cals)

Blend and enjoy.

What does your current weight training routine consist of?
 

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Are you currently taking any whey protein? If so, what brand?
I usually use ON products with water for my protein. Tastes decent and not too expensive.

Thanks for the posts btw.
 
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