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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is a video of our TSM PRO1050 Injectors being bench tested vs. two other competitor 1000cc injectors.

I figured you guys would like to see the difference with your own eyes as the injector is actually firing.

There is a lot happening pretty quickly but I tried to slow it down a little so you could see the actually difference of what is happening in your intake manifold.

Hope this gives you guys some good information.

 

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T1 Race Development
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This is a new Bosch Motorsport injector? Is it a wide cone or a split spray pattern?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yes Tony they are new Bosch Injectors.

Its a 30 degree cone, not split spray.

As i'm sure you know there are a couple split spray injectors from Bosch, however they are quite pricy and hard to get ahold of. We are having pretty awesome results with the 30 degree cone pattern.
 

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You sure about that? Do some digging, that injector has been around for some time, it's for a Polaris snowmobile and is designed to spray into the crankcase of a 2 stroke engine. Bosch Motorsport is a separate division of Bosch. This is NOT a Bosch Motorsport injector.

Do some pressure sensitivity testing, that injector hardly opens at 8v and 5 bar fuel pressure.

Did you do ANY real testing other than looking at a spray pattern and flow rate?

The stock injector is a split spray pattern, suits the head well.

Yours has a 30º cone, that means 30º in all directions. Take a look at the head, the roof of the port is flat right past the injector port. That means 180º of that spray is going directly on the port roof. FAR from the stock split spray pattern.

And do you honestly expect people to believe that you found a 30+% reduction in 'mid range fueling'? "[background=rgb(246, 246, 246)]We had to remove almost 30% fuel through the mid range at partial throttle"[/background]

This would mean that you take a stock car and swap in ID1000's and you have to add 30% fueling to the midrange, which would give you a totally fucked VE table or MAF curve, right?

What makes it 30% different through the 'mid range' and at partial throttle but not elsewhere?
 

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In to watch this one... popcorn is in the microwave
 

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Although this could probably get ugly real fast, I feel like I can learn from the questions Tony asked.
 

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Tony, while I appreciate and respect you as a valued member of the community and an addition to the GT-R world in general the below statement comes across very harsh. I am not attacking you in any way nor have I said that your injectors are sub par to anyone public or private. Please don't turn this into an attack on me, lets keep this professional and most of all informative for the GT-R owners.

That being said, some of the information below is incorrect so I will point that out without trying to start some online battle that will not benefit the community in any way.

And do you honestly expect people to believe that you found a 30+% reduction in 'mid range fueling'? "[background=rgb(246, 246, 246)]We had to remove almost 30% fuel through the mid range at partial throttle"[/background]

This would mean that you take a stock car and swap in ID1000's and you have to add 30% fueling to the midrange, which would give you a totally fucked VE table or MAF curve, right?

What makes it 30% different through the 'mid range' and at partial throttle but not elsewhere?
As for the tuning section of your accusation, I will let Doug answer that if need be as I have not personally tuned these injectors. I will however say that I have spent 3 years telling this community nothing but the truth and have built a reputation around open honest business practice. So attacking me without ever testing or even seeing the product isn't something I feel is founded.

Again I have absolutely no desire to discredit you or your product as we have used, and tuned it for many years without issue with the quality. I simply saw an opportunity to bring something to the GT-R market that I felt would help move us all into better, more efficient modding.

As I would hope everyone knows we don't just market these products, we aren't an online store or a parts slinger. We build cars, race cars, and prove things before we stand behind them. These are no exception.

Thank you for the questions Tony.
 

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Say we were insistent about 2-spray, any idea which one exactly in terms of part number? This is a lot of great info by the way Cicio.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Say we were insistent about 2-spray, any idea which one exactly in terms of part number? This is a lot of great info by the way Cicio.
I am happy to keep looking. Every solution I have found so far would mean 4-5k for injectors by the time they are fitted for the GT-R and match! That is a little pricy LOL
 

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Sorry if I come across harsh, all of the 'competitor's injector' stuff is what makes me come in here and defend my product. I see some false information and think it should be cleared.

In regards to this being a Motorsport piece, notice the part numbers. It's a production piece, it was made FOR Polaris. Polaris didn't find it and decide it works well in the application, it was built for them to their spec. Part of that spec is 3 bar operating pressure. I have seen many claims (not from you, from others selling this 'new motorsport' injector) that these injectors will work up to 8 bar which is not even close to the truth. Fuel Injector Connection has put this rumor out that this is a new "Bosch Motorsport" injector and everyone is slapping their name on it.

This core injector is what's modified by others to make the 1100 and 1150cc injectors.

Notice on the sheet the differentiation between production pieces and Motorsport pieces.


You said you were modifying these injectors for 'slightly more flow', is that really the case? If I test one of yours it'll flow more than the 040 unmodified?

Eager to hear the details from Doug on the 30% reduction in fueling in the midrange and at part throttle.
 

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I am actually just about to order a set of these injectors. I have a lot of respect for both TopSpeed and T1, so this thread is both a good thing, yet confusing to some degree.

In regards to this being a Motorsport piece, notice the part numbers. It's a production piece, it was made FOR Polaris. Polaris didn't find it and decide it works well in the application, it was built for them to their spec. Part of that spec is 3 bar operating pressure.
Also, please explain the above a little more and how that affects my GTR ..
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Sorry if I come across harsh, all of the 'competitor's injector' stuff is what makes me come in here and defend my product. I see some false information and think it should be cleared.

In regards to this being a Motorsport piece, notice the part numbers. It's a production piece, it was made FOR Polaris. Polaris didn't find it and decide it works well in the application, it was built for them to their spec. Part of that spec is 3 bar operating pressure. I have seen many claims (not from you, from others selling this 'new motorsport' injector) that these injectors will work up to 8 bar which is not even close to the truth. Fuel Injector Connection has put this rumor out that this is a new "Bosch Motorsport" injector and everyone is slapping their name on it.

This core injector is what's modified by others to make the 1100 and 1150cc injectors.

Notice on the sheet the differentiation between production pieces and Motorsport pieces.


You said you were modifying these injectors for 'slightly more flow', is that really the case? If I test one of yours it'll flow more than the 040 unmodified?

Eager to hear the details from Doug on the 30% reduction in fueling in the midrange and at part throttle.
I honestly don't see the relevance as to who the injector was made for. None of the aftermarket injectors used in the GT-R were made FOR the GT-R. I can't say that these were not made for Polaris as I honestly don't know, and frankly don't care. You obviously see the value in that OE reliability as well since the ID injector starts off life as a Bosch piece made for Ford. The fact that Bosch made them for an OE company only validifies my faith in them.

As for the Motorsports part of things, these injectors are purchasable through Bosch Motorsports. If I am mistaken in thinking they are a Bosch Motorsports piece since you purchase them through Motorsports then forgive me. I however again don't see how that discredits these in any way as a quality Bosch injector.

I am not attacking you at all, I am simply showing differences between injector spray patterns. The above video even shows to different peoples injectors very specifically to not make people think they were only being compared to ID. I don't know how to compare without something to compare them to. Forgive me if you felt singled out as I did everything possible to do quite the opposite.

Information for the community is the goal. I would gladly send you a set to flow if I felt the data would be unbiased, however after this exchange I am skeptical that would be the case.

I will get Doug in here when he gets off the dyno if he has time. I know he has a family event to attend tonight but I will try my best.

Thank you very much for keeping things civil and informative so this data doesn't get deleted. That is the last thing I would want.
 
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